What happens when a Vitos stuffer crank explodes?

[sicivicdude]

The left side is the one that exploded, correct?

Is the right side discolored brown? They're brilliant blue from the factory.... Was it baked prior to installation or did it drop a seal and start sucking in transmission fluid and discolor it?

I pulled my vito's +3 out of my engine about a month ago to change cases and my crank was still black on the counterbalancers and the stuffers were blue. That's after probably 50 hours (some of that at Busco beach making pass after pass down to the dragstrip for giggles with the guys in September) and it still looked brand new.

I'm not arguing with you Joe, obviously something drastic happened but I'm not narrow minded enough to believe that there is only one possibility for cause that's because "vito's sucks". I'd be more interested in figuring out why this particular crank failed. It is possible that it simply worked its way loose and failed but it's also a possbilility that something else failed and took out the crank. I'd want to be on the lookout for that something else with ANY crank (even a, in your mind, far superior hotrods +4)

 

[blasterdemon7]

Thanks! You f**ked up my motor plans.

 

[CARNZ]

Not EVERY Vito's crank fails...

I'd still run one

 

[blasterdemon7]

I'll just run the +3 and hope for the best. It's a shame you can't just remove the stuffers.

 

[Larry's Shee]

Post # 40 http://www.blasterforum.com/engine-13/vitos-vs-hot-rods-stroker-crank-19091/index4.html

Post# 54 http://www.blasterforum.com/engine-13/vitos-vs-hot-rods-stroker-crank-19091/index6.html

Out of that whole thread started in 09 I saw no proof of crank failures, only talk. One talked of failures but still recomended them to customers? What's with that?

Don't know if I had read that thread before last night but this thread is the only proof I see of failures.

On BHQ I read/see various crank failures, name the mfg. Even $1,000 +++ billit crank works have broke.

How many cranks has John Force broke through the years? Might even still use same brand?

Then you have to start thinking of pecentages, stock, Hot rods std and stroker, vito's std and stroker.

Can anyone provide any other actual proof of this type of failure?? Pics or it didn't happen as you all say.

 

[Paulie B]

Jes throwing my .02. The weed wacker motor world (1/4 scale, 5th scale cars and boats) Stopped using stuffer cranks a while ago for the same reason.
I must admit that I don't hear about it often in quads or dirtbikes. Sorry Slick.

 

[super noober]

wow sorry aobut your bad luck slick.. that sucks big time . fwiw i believe it was just bad luck and i would still run one.. also im pretty sure the guy that snapped the vitos mailed them pics and vids and they actually took care of him but who knows these days.. 8-| good luck man

 

[Blaner]

bang bang slick, bad luck man. now in my mind, these +# cranks have always been a bit of a grey area for me. ive never properly investigated them thoroughly.

I see the point of the stuffer blocks...to decrease the crankcase volume which is increased by adding the spacer plate.

Now, the hotrods doesnt have the stuffer blocks so to use the hotrods crank with a spacer plate is going to result in increased crank case volume.

So the only to make the hotrods work without the crankcase volume issue is not to use a spacer?

can anyone explain this to me? how do you get the porting right without using a spacer?
If its a +4 that means that the crank will give an extra 2mm over and above normal TDC and 2mm below normal BDC - why trenching is needed. No at the top, the piston will protrude above deck, how do I work this if my head is already designed for 1.1mm squish? surely TDC will be somewhere amidst some Japanese alloy?

 

[sicivicdude]

The hot rods crank is not supplied with a spacer plate. They expect the head to be redesigned around the increased stroke of the stroker crank. The squish area is cut farther into the head to allow the piston to come up into it. Because the ring lands are down the piston just a hair, the rings still stay just down inside the cylinder at TDC.

 

[piezzi]

The hot rods crank is not supplied with a spacer plate. They expect the head to be redesigned around the increased stroke of the stroker crank. The squish area is cut farther into the head to allow the piston to come up into it. Because the ring lands are down the piston just a hair, the rings still stay just down inside the cylinder at TDC.

Good explanation....thanks dude!

 

[sicivicdude]

actually, the original Hot Rods +4mm stroker crank box has a label on it that reads

"WARNING! installation of this crank requires that the crankcase be modified to allow .020" of clearance from the crankcase to the big end of the rod. It is also necessary to modify the head. Final cranking pressures should be between 150-170 psi. If you cannot do this DO NOT ATTEMPT! Allow a qualified mechanic to install"

(^^^ or something like that)

 

[slickerthanyou]

The left side is the one that exploded, correct?

Is the right side discolored brown? They're brilliant blue from the factory.... Was it baked prior to installation or did it drop a seal and start sucking in transmission fluid and discolor it?

I pulled my vito's +3 out of my engine about a month ago to change cases and my crank was still black on the counterbalancers and the stuffers were blue. That's after probably 50 hours (some of that at Busco beach making pass after pass down to the dragstrip for giggles with the guys in September) and it still looked brand new.

Yes the outside of the stuffers are brown both sides, I"m sure it sucked in tranny fluid as I could not get the thing to pump up air for a leak test just poured out the vent tube , I clamped that and it came out the stator side seal because it is all bent to hell. I haven't pulled the clutch side yet, hope it didn't take out my hinson basket! Tonight when I get home, I'm gonna look pull the bottom end and take a vid of the crank moving , kinda reminds me of a cam!! That's how bent it is!

I will send vitos some photos and a vid, worst they can say is nope! I am going to run the new motor with the +3 I'm hoping this is an isolated incident and I can chalk it up to just that! But i may learn more once i dissasemble it??? Will report what I find regaurdless!

A positive note, I get to do another build!!!!!

 

[Paulie B]

The stuffer cranks are more of a marketing ploy anyway. I would be surprised to see any HP gain from them.
I would love to see someone test the compression from a crank with them and the same crank with them removed just to see the difference.

 

[brandoz28]

That sounds about like the right wording.
basically the +3mm is produced so the the "just slap her in and go" guys can use it. The hotrods +4mm cranks are designed to be installed by an engine builder, and then modifications made around running it.

The big end of the +4 crank actually sticks out of the web, which is why trenching is required

 

[brandoz28]

That sounds about like the right wording.
basically the +3mm is produced so the the "just slap her in and go" guys can use it. The hotrods +4mm cranks are designed to be installed by an engine builder, and then modifications made around running it.

The big end of the +4 crank actually sticks out of the web, which is why trenching is required

 

[sicivicdude]

Yes the outside of the stuffers are brown both sides, I"m sure it sucked in tranny fluid as I could not get the thing to pump up air for a leak test just poured out the vent tube , I clamped that and it came out the stator side seal because it is all bent to hell. I haven't pulled the clutch side yet, hope it didn't take out my hinson basket! Tonight when I get home, I'm gonna look pull the bottom end and take a vid of the crank moving , kinda reminds me of a cam!! That's how bent it is!

I will send vitos some photos and a vid, worst they can say is nope! I am going to run the new motor with the +3 I'm hoping this is an isolated incident and I can chalk it up to just that! But i may learn more once i dissasemble it??? Will report what I find regaurdless!

A positive note, I get to do another build!!!!!

I'm sure the stator side seal was probably damaged by the "explosion". The clutch side seal, however, I'd be suspicious of. The brown coloration looks like the color of the case when one has been sucking in transmission fluid....

 

[Quadrider10]

damn.... u werent kinnin when u said "blew up"

 

[slickerthanyou]

I'm sure the stator side seal was probably damaged by the "explosion". The clutch side seal, however, I'd be suspicious of. The brown coloration looks like the color of the case when one has been sucking in transmission fluid....

But it was leak tested before he took the quad , unless it happened during riding?? My son is not experienced and really is one of those kids that is really not interesed in "how it works", or wants to learn the wrenching part. I don't pressure him to work on it, some people just aren't into that! AKA Mommas boy! But deep down he is a great kid!

Anyhow, later this evening I will pull the clutch cover off and see what mess is in there. Time to go make that video i promised.... BRB I:I

 

[slickerthanyou]

Vids! Who says a blaster doesn't have a cam!

From stator side-

From the clutch side-

 

[Quadrider10]

....i subbed u....